Connemara Pony Breeders’ Society
Meeting with ICCPS Delegates 16/8/11
Venue: Station House Hotel, Clifden, Co. Galway @ 9am
Attendance: Mr. Andrew O’Donoghue (President, CPBS), Mr. Dermot Power, Mr. John Riordan, Mr. Mark Maguire (Dept. of Agriculture), Ms. Niamh Philbin, Mr. Padraic Heanue, Mr. Pat Mullen, Ms. Jane Andrews, Ms. Shirley Sauvé, Ms. Helena de Belloy, Mr. Olivier Verove, Ms. Anne Storme, Mr. Joop de Jong, Ms. Maiken Holit, MS. Sarah Hodgkins, Ms. Henrietta Knight, Ms. Susan McConnell, Ms. Tuula Pyoria, Ms. Madeline Beckman, Mr. Vermund Lyngstad, Ms. Karen Holloway.
Mr. O’Donoghue opened the meeting and thanked the delegates for attending. He introduced himself to the meeting. Mr. O’Donoghue proposed a minutes silence for Susan McConnell’s Mother who recently passed away, this was observed. Each person around the table then introduced themselves.
Mr. O’Donoghue explained the meeting as originally scheduled for Monday but as this did not suit a number of delegates it was re-scheduled to Tuesday. He told the delegates the main purpose of the meeting is to discuss the Studbook Principles. Mr. O’Donoghue said he understood some countries may have problems in implementing some areas of the principles and he asked that they discuss any problems they are encountering. He also explained that Mark Maguire from the Department of Agriculture is in attendance to assist the delegates.
CPBS Studbook Principles
Mr. O’Donoghue read out the CPBS Studbook Principles section by section. Each section was discussed. Ms. Pyoria felt under characteristics of the breed it should say “occasionally BECS”. Ms. Knight suggested phrasing it as “cream”. Ms. Beckman said the same could be said about over height ponies but they are not included in characteristics as they are not “desired”. Mr. Riordan felt BEC’s should not be discriminated against. Ms. McConnell said it is a case of genotype verses phenotype. Ms. Knight suggested changing desired to preferred. Mr. Riordan felt preferences shouldn’t come into it and that the characteristics of a breed are very subjective to the individual. Ms. Holloway suggested explaining in the characteristics that BECs will be in Class two. Ms. Philbin explained that these are the criteria for a Class one pony and therefore does not include BECs and over height ponies. Mr. Riordan agreed and suggested saying these are the characteristics for a pony to b eligible for inclusion in Class One.
Ms. Holloway asked that under conditions for entering the studbook could “EU Approved” be changed to EU approved or CPBS approved for non-EU countries. Mr. Maguire agreed with this. Mr. O’Donoghue asked the Danish delegate if Denmark enforce DNA typing. Ms. Holit confirmed that all ponies are DNA typed. MS. Beckman said there are three year old fillies in Denmark not DNA typed. Ms. McConnell asked is there a common procedure for the vet inspection or does it change country to country. Mr. O’Donoghue said the Irish vet does a very thorough job on the colts but on fillies’ just checks the eyes, mouth and measures them. Ms. Pyoria said in Finland an authorised person measures the fillies and looks at their teeth. Mr. Riordan suggested the second line under Class one be removed. Ms. Beckman said she has no problem with the vetting of the colts but suggested that the rules should say a mare has to be healthy and sound. Mr. Maguire said there should be a minimum level vetting criteria for colts and fillies. Mr. Riordan suggested asking Philip McManus to draw up a minimum standard for vetting colts and fillies. Mr. Power suggested that pony owners get a cert from their local vet. Mr. Langstad agreed with having a minimum standard as he felt it would be useful for vets who have not had a lot of experience with horses. MS. Beckman felt it would be too expensive on pony owners. Mr. Riordan asked who defines the health of a pony in Sweden. Ms. Beckman said the Inspection team who are approved by the Society. Ms. Holit felt an inspector would be very bad if he/she could not see basic veterinary items. She said there is no legislation which say a pony has to be inspected by a vet and suggested providing a checklist for the inspection team. Mr. Power suggested leaving the three classes as they are and include at the end “in some countries inspectors send on for the vet”. Ms. Hodgkins said then mares wouldn’t be vetted. Mr. Maguire said it is up to the CPBS to set the minimum standard.
Ms. Pyoria asked what the minimum marking standard is. Mr. O’Donoghue said each country sets it’s own. Ms. Hodgkins asked if a filly is Class one in one country must it be Class one in another country. Mr. Power explained that ponies can also be classified into Class three. Mr. O’Donoghue said the CPBS Council is considering taking top performance ponies as Class one ponies. Ms. Knight asked if pony owners sign for a form to abide by the classification rules. Ms. Philbin said they do. Ms. Beckman said a Class one pony should be a pony of good type and should not just go into Class one because of it’s performance record.
Ms. Beckman asked what the situation is with a stallion in Class three whose dam is dead and was never inspected. She asked if there is any possibility he could be inspected. Mr. O’Donoghue said no and that the CPBS is experiencing the same problem.
Mr. Verove explained to the meeting that not all ponies in France are inspected. Mr. Power said they would have to find a way to inspect ponies as it would cause problems for their offspring. Ms. Holloway suggested inspecting ponies at a reduced rate. Ms. Hodgkins felt ponies in Class three should be identified by a different cover on their passport. Ms. Philbin said eh CPBS use a Classification page in the passport to identify which class the animal is in. Mr. Maguire felt this was a better method than using a different cover. Ms. Knight said this is very difficult for people attending sales as they don’t see the passports. Mr. Maguire suggested inserting a loose sheet explaining classification. Mr. Riordan suggested issuing a white passport to a foal that can’t move out of Class three. Ms. Beckman expressed concerns that a Class one stallion in France may be from un-inspected parents. Mr. Langstad explained in Norway not all ponies that breed are inspected. Mr. O’Donoghue said the CPBS will meet with the French Society to discuss it further.
Ms. Hodgkins asked if the CPBS inspect geldings. Mr. O’Donoghue said no. Ms. Pyoria asked what the situation is with approved inspectors. Mr. O’Donoghue asked each country to forward a list of their inspectors to the CPBS for them to approve it. Ms. Beckman said Sweden there is only one inspector for fillies. Mr. O’Donoghue said there will have to be two.
Ms. Hodgkins asked how important the registration number is. She explained that the BCPS issue a FC number and the then an adult number in addition to the UELN number. Mr. Maguire said this is fine. Ms. Holit said UELN numbers can be found on www.ueln.net.
Ms. McConnell asked, regarding prefixes, is it only within one country. Mr. O’Donoghue said the Irish prefixes are not to be used in any other countries. Mr. O’Donoghue asked Mr. de Jong if Holland DNA’s all ponies. Mr. de Jong told him only stallions are DNA’d. Mr. Maguire said all ponies have to be DNA’d. Ms. Holloway said the Australian Society is having difficulty in getting information from the Irish Lab. Ms. Philbin said she would contact the Irish lab.
There being no further business. Mr. O’Donoghue closed the meeting.